Trademarking names and logos... Any help?

Hi All,

Following on from James post, I was also wondering if there was a way of protecting a Ltd company name overseas?

For example, if you have a ltd company, and you wanted to protect the name globally (i.e. didn't want someone overseas using the same name to avoid confusion) Is there a way of protecting a ltd company name overseas?

Richard 

There is the one school of thought (usually given by those who make a living out of it) that will advise you to err on the side of caution with everything you do in business, protect everything, insure everything, trademark, patent, get lawyers to check all contracts (even though they're written in English!), etc. Going down this route can be expensive, especially internationally, and even then you are left to make the decision of whether you can afford to take someone to court if you think they are exploiting your property.

Since fully protecting yourself can be very expensive, it is usually only the bigger companies that do absolutely everything they can to protect themselves. In some cases it works and it pays off. In other cases you can spend millions protecting yourself and still end with dodgy goods being sold at car boot sales (fake designer goods, fake toys, pirated music, movies, games, etc). I wonder how many high profile patents, trademarks, licenses etc are violated on a daily basis in the UK via market stalls/car boot sales/black market?

For smaller companies you have to consider how far you are willing to go to protect yourself, how much it costs in comparison to your money situation, will it break the bank? It is possible to over-protect yourself to the extent that you spend so much money on it that you end up bankrupt!

With your unique name, check it is unique first by googling it, checking with companies house, checking if web domain names have been registered etc. Now if you are just worried about someone nicking your company name in the UK, then if you have already registered the company with companies house, and have the web domain name, you are already making it awkward/difficult for another UK company to have that name. If you operate on an international level, then buying non UK web domains e.g. clevername.com, clevername.net is also a cheap way, not foolproof, of putting off people in other countries starting the same company name. If you are UK only then trademarks might be worth looking into too, depending on your situation.

Disclaimer: Please bear in mind that I am not a lawyer or an accountant, just a fellow business person trying to offer some of what I see as common sense advice. Such advice suits my particular small business, but may not be appropriate for other businesses.
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Paul - www.awebapart.com - 'a web apart'
create, update your website today - the online professional site builder

Hi James,

The Patent Office will trademark you a name / logo in one business class for £200.  They don't refund this if the name is contested, if it is not available or if it is not suitable for registration.  They recommend you do a search to inform you of any potential risks before registering which costs about £87.50.

If you use a trademark lawyer the costs will spiral but they could offer advice on how to combat any danger areas.

Basically you have automatic copyright on anything you design yourself or commission.  In order to prove copyright you must prove the idea was original, and when it was conceived.  (Hence sending registered delivery envelopes to yourself!). 

I was prepared to protect my business using just this until I realised that another company was using a similar name to mine & that they had registered with Companies House & with a trademark.  However we are in different business categories & in order to prtect my own claim to the name I registered the name for Business Services.

All this could have been avoided if I had simply followed the very good advice given on here - check the domain, google it, companies house search & then think about protecting it!

Caroline Melville

www.virtuallysorted.com

www.SocietyOfVirtualAssistants.co.uk

It surprises me how many people don't have copyright assigned to them (in writing) by their designer...
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Logo Design • Vector Conversion • Print
Eagle Imagery™ It's the only way to be sure...
UK Business Labs http://www.ukbusinesslabs.co.uk/forums/

Eagle is right. You may not already own the copyright to your logo, your logo designer may own this. It is an unwritten rule in the design, art, photography, software world, etc that just because a supplier does some paid work for a client that doesn't entitle the client to own the copyright for the work, well its written down somewhere but people don't shout about it much.

You pay a photographer to take pictures at your wedding, who own's the copyright for that perfect picture of the bride and groom? the photographer generally. You buy an original painting by a local artist, who owns the copyright? the artist, you are not allowed to make any money by offering prints of this painting. You get a web designer to design your company website, who owns the copyright? the web designer generally.

If you need to own the copyright for a piece of work, you have to explicitly state this before the work is done, by getting it in writing such things as 'this is a work for hire project' and 'all copyright, source code, etc' will be owned or will be transferred to the client.

It is good to see that the eagleimagery website is upfront and honest about this issue on their website.
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Paul - www.awebapart.com - 'a web apart'
create, update your website today - the online professional site builder

Hi James

I have been involved heavily with trademarking over the last 6 months and have paid far more than £200 I CAN TELL YOU! There are three things you have to consider how much of an asset is that specific name for your business. Is it something that your competition will want to use to exploit your customers goodwill. Are you in a position where your name and logo are critical at setting apart your business form others. If the answer to any of these questions is no and you dont have a large amount of resources for the just in case factor, there is no rush. Bear one thing in mind it is a gamble you can spend a lot of money and walk away with nothing cos some schmo feels that you are infringing on their rights and has more money to fight in the courts than you. 

Hi James,

Anthony's quite correct.  It costs around £400 for a trademark in one class (the type of goods or service) which is made up of half to the trademarks Office and half to the Lawyer.  Other advice as to justification of whether to trademark or not should be highly regarded.

Cheers, Nigel

This is very worrying for me as I have started an internet community and it was actually one of my members that brought the TM issue to my mind as a company has demanded that he changes HIS business name and all his online blogs etc.

My '.org' online community is two years old and I am slowly pushing it into the US. There used to be a '.com' belonging to another company but it's no longer online. I am waiting for first refusal when the name becomes available.

If a company comes along and calls themselves by the same name and then trademarks it do I have to give up all I have worked for?

How much protection is recommended? Without success in the US, my community's earnings will be severely limited.

regards,

David

Hi,

I'm a graphic designer/identity designer and I've written a simple to understand (hopefully) guide about this at; http://www.trulyace.com/blog/trademarking-and-logo-design/. It also has useful links to the TM office.

It's only £200 to register a TM in one class (you don't have to use a lawyer you see) - but depending on how it goes you can incurr a lot more costs that this. This isn't necessarily the norm however, and for many it's simple and doesn't cost any more than £200.00. You only incur extra costs if your attempt to register is disputed.

Don't let this put you off at least looking into it and finding out the risks (once you are sure you are the copyright owner of the logo design that is), the initial advice costs are fairly low as already mentioned, and for you it may be a simple process.
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Regards

Amanda


Truly Ace Graphic Design Blog


Logo Design I Web Design I Print Design